Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by Fun CH »

Was happy to see the MNBB remove a long Covid misinformation diatribe.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by PAL »

Yes, probably best to vent to a friend. But some people, I guess want the whole world to know. I'm including myself in there at times.
Regarding South Cr., I spoke with a person, whose name I promised not to mention, that got permission from the landowner, to cross. I think that's what is required. Just talk to him. Not call him names. Access to the trail came about because Jack chose to close it off due to people vandalizing his cameras, leaving nasty notes and crossing anyway. Then once the ranting began, he dug in deeper. To repeat he didn't give access before the BB rants came about.
I have every reason to believe my friend did talk to April and that is what was discussed. But I think you are largely right that they will only take a post off if there is a complaint. On the hospital post, I thought there were probably complaints even before it was finally removed. It was getting divisive.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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PAL wrote: Thu Aug 26, 2021 6:38 am A friend of mine talked to April at Methownet, and April says she does monitor it. How often, who knows.
The solution would be to have a separate category like Methow.com does. Which never gets used. Gone by the wayside. But that would mean they would still need to clean it up occasionally.
I think sometimes the posts start out as public service announcements, but someone will always comment, not necessarily negative. People need a place to vent. FB, Twitter and Instagram allow for that, so people need to go there. Many people don't like those forums however for various reasons.
Glad we have this one. It's been mostly respectful on here.

Quote: "A friend of mine talked to April and she said"..

That of course is hersay evidence. The fact is that Maria told me that they don't read it. Perhaps the policy changed because the optics of not moderating your own forum doesn't look good. Still that forum doesn't look moderated until a member reports a rule violation.

As far as needing to vent. The internet is a goldmine to psychologists studying human behavior. Research is showing that online venting may feel good for the short-term but it's just making people angrier in the long run. So it's really not good for you.

And look at the results. A more divided country and a platform to repeat hateful and misinformed rhetoric. Why is that?

Politicians, PR firms, con men and ad agencies understand very well how to manipulate human psychology in order to sell product.

Another local result is losing public access to the South Creek trail through online venting that contains utterly disrespectful comments directed towards property owners asserting their rights.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by mister_coffee »

Honestly, words just fail me.

Thinking about the hospital thread yesterday, and re-reading it this morning (thanks again, Ray!) I realized the "conversation" there was analogous to having a discussion with an adult who believes in Santa Claus. They go off about the North Pole, elves, reindeer, and going down chimneys. I felt I was patiently explaining to them why they were mistaken.

It is both immensely frustrating and kind of absurd. Which most tragedies are.

When you zoom out, what we have right now in this country is a large population who are in the middle of an existential mental health emergency. That's why adults are freaking out on airplanes (over 3000 events so far this year, as opposed to around 150 in a normal full year). That's why I've seen grown men throw full-on temper tantrums that would impress any four-year-old in Wal-Mart. I also think that's why so many people are willing to believe absurd conspiracy theories about COVID-19, public health measures designed to keep people safe, and vaccines for the disease. Or for that matter about the 2020 election.

As for that other board, it seems that if they are going to keep it, they should have a clearly written policy as a sticky thread and they should stick to their policy and enforce it in a consistent, clear, and transparent fashion. It also wouldn't hurt if they recruited respected members of the board's community to be moderators.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by PAL »

A friend of mine talked to April at Methownet, and April says she does monitor it. How often, who knows.
The solution would be to have a separate category like Methow.com does. Which never gets used. Gone by the wayside. But that would mean they would still need to clean it up occasionally.
I think sometimes the posts start out as public service announcements, but someone will always comment, not necessarily negative. People need a place to vent. FB, Twitter and Instagram allow for that, so people need to go there. Many people don't like those forums however for various reasons.
Glad we have this one. It's been mostly respectful on here.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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PAL wrote: Wed Aug 25, 2021 4:36 pm They watch the threads like the latest hospital post and when it gets to a "tipping point", they take it off.
According to Maria, they don't read the threads.

Any moderation of specific posts happens at the membership level when a post is reported for a rules violation. But that appears to take time in some cases to delete posts and in many cases entire threads are pulled.

So people being civil who take the time to post the facts on a subject will also have their posts deleted even without have broken any forum rules.

That is poor moderation and its not working out well.. But my understanding is that that forum has had problems for many years.

I can't understand why they don't just get rid of opinion type threads and focus on what they do best ie buy/sell/wanted ads and community notices such as the TV is out.

On that pulled thread, the person who didn't sign her name made a few good points such push back on name calling, anti division and the fact that the FDA recalls a.large number of previously approved drugs.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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They watch the threads like the latest hospital post and when it gets to a "tipping point", they take it off. And it was reaching a tipping point. Pointing out names of businesses and people and name calling. Presenting misinformation, which it is not, to the people presenting it. So, it was taken off.
Read today's MVN. Tell me where the hostility is coming from. It's very obvious in the paper, who it is coming from.
It sure it dividing our community. And the hostility on the BB was on both sides, at times. I will speak up for David. He was valiantly trying to give out very good information. But after awhile, it is frustrating and minds won't be changed anyway. But I think, I have to keep trying.
I just keep saying that those that are vaccinated have been very patient and me thinks my patience is running thin.
People start talking about how their freedom is being impinged upon. How it's like Nazi Germany or it's Marxist. They need to read their history. They have no clue.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by Mark58 »

My guess is that underlying it all is the fact that Methownet is a business. So making money takes precedence and pissing some people off might lead to loss of revenue, so they just axe potentially controversial topics. Pretty sad, particularly because they cut off some voices of reason.

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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by anonloser »

I can't tell if the mods only check once every few days or if they just have an immense bias towards bull***. Because obviously they just nuke whole threads, but if I make a "quit your bull***" comment without a signature it doesn't last more than 12 hours while straight up right wing disinformation will last dayyyys some times.

It is in fact a mess.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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They zapped my thread about the missing thread and it was properly signed... Jeesh...
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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anonloser wrote: Wed Aug 18, 2021 4:52 pm It was not great before the name rule, but the rule hasn't fixed the issue. It's just made it less useful for most people. What it needs is either proper moderation or tools for the community at large to self moderate. The former is prone to bias and the latter to manipulation, but it would be more useful than it's current state.

And I agree. Different sections are needed.
I just checked a thread about Covid hospital rates. Two posters without signatures are heavy into a repeating a Covid vaccine disinformation campaign.

Anyonr can check to see if the rules violation has been reported by clicking on the ! icon.

All the posts without signatures have been reported, some a few days old, and the posts are still there.

So the community members are making an effort to have everyone follow the rules.

But the owners don't even enforce their own rules.

What a mess.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by anonloser »

It was not great before the name rule, but the rule hasn't fixed the issue. It's just made it less useful for most people. What it needs is either proper moderation or tools for the community at large to self moderate. The former is prone to bias and the latter to manipulation, but it would be more useful than it's current state.

And I agree. Different sections are needed.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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I didn't read the bulletin board when the whole signature things started but I heard there was really bad behavior before that.

I have a few friends that won't even read the thing anymore because they were personally attacked when that whole REA co-op controversy was taking place.

It should be geared towards buy and sell and place to post community activities and notices.

At the very least they should have a separate section of the forum for the opinions as they tend to displace people trying get rid of buy/sell/ free
stuff.

The new opinion section could have a title something like "the padded room". ;)
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by anonloser »

I was threatened for banning because they were "tired of having to delete my posts." I checked and they had had to remove two of my posts for an opinion without signature over a two year period. A third one they removed was directions on how to add a user to the "Friends and Foes" list. So, step by step directions to use a feature on their own site qualified for deletion and an emailed threat for being "snarky".

Not sure if they got the wrong person or what, but the rules and moderation are inconsistently enforced and their definition of what constitutes an "opinion" is inaccurate.

As a side rant, the rule that an opinion must be accompanied by a name has proven to be completely useless. It's only accomplishment is to ensure that completely unfounded claims and baseless "opinions" can be posted by those who are divorced from reality. Any attempt at moderate discussion or factual conversation can be derailed by whatever insane commentary so long as you put a name on it and then ultimately that conversation will be deleted because it's "political". Why would any sane moderate person want to get involved with someone yelling "screw your science". Or one of my other favorites was someone yelling about liberals being too cowardly to post their opinion and then in the same sentence making thinly veiled threats of physical harm to those exact people for disagreeing. Yeah, no sh** people don't feel like publicly outing themselves with someone who feels 100% comfortable making physical threats in a public space.

They should just call it a classifieds and give up on providing a place for discussion since there's none of substance to be had.

End vent. Thanks for coming to my ted talk.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by mister_coffee »

Looks like "barnone" is taking his post removals personally and blames you for them.

Some people...
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by PAL »

You know, I almost called them after I got back from my hike to ask the to take down my post about the Watershed Music Festival. I confess I knew that by posting it I would get some negative responses, but knew I would get mostly positive and informative responses. I may still call them, but the post has sort of faded away, because the people responding now, are not going to get a response from me. It may die on it's own. If one of them revives it, I will call them. It seemed to be upsetting someone greatly and I thought I should have it taken down.
Will see what tomorrow brings. Unless David says something!
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by tristanbgilb »

I have found lots of neat stuff on the www.Methownet.com bulletin board including a free tandem bike. It gets lots of traffic but I was kicked off it years ago and had to call and ask to be reinstated as a member promising to be a good citizen.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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Sad the MethownetBB continues to provide a platform for disimformation concerning lies such as a stolen election and covid is a hoax.

Its long past time for that BB to act responsibly and not continue to be a platform for community divisivness and harm that prolongs this pandamic. Jeff and Maria, this is on you. Members should not have to police your forum for you.
Moderate your forum Or shut it down, please.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by Fun CH »

David, those are all very good points. However don't you think It is important to remain civil and refrain from public name calling or personal attack as much as possible?

I do acknowledge that is not an always an easy thing to do and twice now on the internet I've done just that. So I do have some experience with this issue and tend to regret those actions due to my lack of empathy in those particular instances.



But can't outrage be expressed intelligently and with respect?
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by mister_coffee »

From Jessica Wildfire (https://jessicalexicus.medium.com/)
There’s this idea that if you’re a smart, enlightened person then you’re not allowed to express outrage, or even sarcasm. You have to tolerate everyone and their dumb arse opinions. You have to do all the work to see where they’re coming from. You have to find ways to convince them to do the right thing, even if they make zero effort to meet you halfway.
Enough with outreach and understanding. Respecting “other opinions” is making things worse. It validates selfishness, and sets us up for the next disaster where they refuse to do the right thing. Meanwhile, it doesn’t matter how hard we try to respect their distorted notions of personal liberty, because they never, ever return the favor. They’re more than happy to violate other people’s rights in the name of their own causes. Our society can’t take any more of this. Good people are suffering.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

Post by Fun CH »

pasayten wrote: Mon Jul 26, 2021 1:38 pm Jeesh... another thread on methownet talking about the fire and alf had a critical of fire fighters reply... POOF... thread gone... :-(

P.S. I do have a copy of alf's reply... :-)
I find it best to no longer read what he posts.
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Re: Kicked Off the Methownet BB

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Jeesh... another thread on methownet talking about the fire and alf had a critical of fire fighters reply... POOF... thread gone... :-(

P.S. I do have a copy of alf's reply... :-)
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Re: Kicked Off the BB

Post by Fun CH »

pasayten wrote: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:14 am Not kicked off, but methownet removed my post letting folks know the link to the Fire Info BB thread on this BB... and didn't add it to their "fire info links" page... Can't stand a better source for info!!! Jeesh... lol... :-)

In actuality, the methownet BB is not well suited for the easy dissemination of important information in significant events affecting the community due to its curtailed features found on most bulletin boards... Pictures, pdf files, and offsite links. They may do this to a lack of staff time for moderation during normal times, but I firmly believe in times like this, these features should be turned on.
agree. The NMBB is not even good for fire emergency situations. Lots of hate, rumor, hearsay, conjecture, allegations, posts without providing the source, opinions offered that are not based on fact, and even agreeing with people's actions to break the law who are going into closed areas of the National Forest.

So not a community resourse at all and no longer relevant except for buy and sell stuff.

Contrast that to your fire emergency page Ray which has been most helpful in providing factual fire information with links to the source.

Facts matter, especially during an emergency.

@David. I called that one the day before the emergency. You did need help and most likely from some who have been hesitant to receive the vaccine and supported Trump.

Sorry to hear you lost some property and good that you thanked thoses members of our community who helped you during your time of need.

I'm hoping you're starting to understand my point. We're all in this together.
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Re: Kicked Off the BB

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Not kicked off, but methownet removed my post letting folks know the link to the Fire Info BB thread on this BB... and didn't add it to their "fire info links" page... Can't stand a better source for info!!! Jeesh... lol... :-)

In actuality, the methownet BB is not well suited for the easy dissemination of important information in significant events affecting the community due to its curtailed features found on most bulletin boards... Pictures, pdf files, and offsite links. They may do this to a lack of staff time for moderation during normal times, but I firmly believe in times like this, these features should be turned on.
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Re: Kicked Off the BB

Post by Fun CH »

Fraulein57, Also nail on the head with a bit a humor.

As you say, David has gone beyond the simple shaming (his self proclaimed goal) towards "hostility"directed at
other members of our community.

This hostility also seems politically motivated because presumably only Republicans are refusing to be vaccinated. Although Trump received the vaccine even after his life was saved by advances in medical science (an infusion of Regeneron) after he contracted covid 19.

Bruce is also on this same rampage at the MNBB although he's only goes so far as calling people who have concerns about the vaccine as "ignorant".

In this quote from the MNBB, concerning the state of Missouri, he fails to mention that California is also seeing increased cases of Covid 19.

"Today the State requested emergency federal aid to battle the outbreak. So,, the states that have been vaccinated get to pay for the ignorance of the states (like Missouri,Alabama,Utah, Arkansas etc)that did not get vaccinated. Bruce Herron Wolf Creek"

At first I thought that there is some sort of privileged supremacy attitude reflected in his statement. Does he also include the 11% percent black population of Missouri as being ignorant?

A simple scan of the facts would show that many minority communities have not had equitable access to the vaccine. But let's not let facts get in the way of our opinion right?

We all suffer from ignorance at one time or another in our lives but in this case both David and Bruce should perhaps consider the way they treat ordinary people living in our diverse community.

Or perhaps they may want to continue the unfounded divisive rhetoric and check the person's political affiliation and vaccine statis so they have the option to refuse help with any fire or other emergency Services they may require.
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