Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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tristanbgilb
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by tristanbgilb »

Fun CH wrote: Mon Feb 07, 2022 10:42 pm

I'm glad I blindly took penicillin when I had a bacterial pneumonia in the fourth grade.

Penicillin and other antibiotics are modern miracles for the medical profession but have side effects and thus I am unqualified in their use. The MRI is considered the other modern miracle of medicine. The MRI saved my life with imaging allowing a Neurosurgeon who had a medical degree in osteopathic medicine to go in and finally fix my broken neck that I was about to die from. For me technology caught up just in time to keep this body going. I grew up on my fair share of antibiotics. I am not against them when used cautiously. The trouble is that after killing all the bacteria in your body, somehow you have to get good flora going before yeast takes over or even worse evil deadly staph infections and so forth. There are the common ways of eating yogurt or miso. Fermented foods like sourcrout have bacteria when unpasteurized. My interest in this area is colostrum from human or maybe even goat milk. I really wonder how all this antibody immune system works in the first meals of the human baby. Reformulating colostrum for adults could be an answer. I don't really know enough to say. My brother suggested people are eating human turds in pills to get bacteria back into their guts. I wonder if colostrum can be reproduced or grown in a laboratory. I wonder not knowing what it really would take. I also wonder if covid immunity is passed from mother to offspring after covid vaccination.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by Fun CH »

I'm glad I blindly took penicillin when I had a bacterial pneumonia in the fourth grade. I trusted that my family physician was acting in my best interest.

Saved my life and back then they made house calls.

But yea, the first course of action for many disorders and illnesses is diet modification and behavior modification such as giving up smoking,losing weight, more exercise etc.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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As a natural healer or barefoot doctor, my first rule is Do NO HARM. Second Rule is let food be thy medicine. Third rule is flush. Fourth Rule of natural healing is oxygenate. Finally Nutrutionate.

We expect more from our formally trained healers Like the Medical Doctors and so forth. Their path is more Machiavellian where "The Ends Justifies the Means", or the benefits outweigh the risks. I think politics and money have corrupted the medical profession to the point that people who blindly take prescriptions are risking their health. I would not be alive if not for medical intervention, so I thank them in every way. Now that I am not in crisis I go to flush, oxygenate, nutritionate...

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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tristanbgilb wrote: Sun Feb 06, 2022 6:10 pm

I have educated myself further on the subject of bacteria and germs, and it is clear to me that "Typhoid Mary" was not an asymptomatic carrier, so she was not a vector for disease.

There is scientific Method. You have a hypothesis that Typhoid Mary was a scapegoat rather than source of some outbreak of typhoid fever. Now you have stated that you have explored your hypothesis and you have a theory. Any theory is only 99% sort of thing. Nothing can be known 100% with science. We have scientific laws that even my great Scientist Dad, Doctor Grant O Gilbert, PhD taught me not to take at 100%. 100% Does not exist in science. A good scientist is willing to be wrong sometimes and still explore. I studied epidemiology just a bit at The Evergreen State College. There is something called a holding capacity of an environment for a species. The real unanswerable question is " What is the Holding Capacity of the planet earth for the human species?" This would help us determine courses of action if we are to rely on science for a solution to mankind problems.

There is a Dr. Gilbert in this article. He is portrayed as the villain though! Here is an excerpt:

" The "Typhoid Mary" case was of recent times. She died only a few years ago in prison. But our present-day medical men have not advanced out of the Dark Ages yet; they still chase down healthy, innocent people who do not develop typhoid after being near typhoid cases. These cases are even now, branded as "carriers" and hounded by medical men driven by medical ignorance. This is borne out by no less a medical authority than Roy O. Gilbert, M.D. (L.A County Health Officer.) In the Los Angeles News Herald, 1954, Dr. Gilbert wrote an article titled "Spread of Typhoid Stopped by Apprehension of Carrier." In this article he states: "Typhoid carriers are individuals who act as symptom-free portable reservoirs for the germs of the disease and many of them are unaware that they may transmit the infection."

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sf3.html#%2 ... %20CARRIER

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by woodman »

mister_coffee wrote: Sun Feb 06, 2022 6:01 pm

I don't know about any of that. Maybe if you posted your sources you used to draw those conclusions and showed your work?

Anyway, FWIW cases seem to be going down slightly in Okanogan County, but hospitalizations are still on the rise.

Elsewhere in the state it appears cases and hospitalizations are dropping.

They say you can search the internet and find anything to support any narrative, but I leave you with this... First here is an excerpt from the article.

"On checking the news items on Typhoid outbreaks over the past years, we find that the cases are among the guests of a wedding party, a camp meeting, a picnic, or some other gathering where food was served without refrigeration and sanitary supervision. Foods containing milk, meat and eggs are highly putrefactive out of refrigeration, and can generate toxins which cause vomiting, fever, intestinal disturbance and other symptoms of food poisoning, Whether or not the doctors find typhoid bacilli in the patients does not prove a thing, because all kinds of germs are found in sick people. The germs do not cause the disease; they evolve out of the dying cells and do a useful, remedial work."

"The doctors have not been able to control the diseases because they are forever looking in the wrong direction for the causes. The cause is usually some form of body poisoning."

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sf3.html#%2 ... %20CARRIER

Also, I read a version of the acceptable narrative on Typhoid Mary, and the thing that stands out in my mind is that there was an assumption that the typhoid pathogen was stored in her gallbladder, and they say that she was never willing to give a sample, BUT after she died in 1938, they did not take a sample at that time before she was cremated. That is suspicious to me. It's more than likely that they did take a sample, and they didn't get the result they wanted.

Last edited by woodman on Mon Feb 07, 2022 6:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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I have educated myself further on the subject of bacteria and germs, and it is clear to me that "Typhoid Mary" was not an asymptomatic carrier, so she was not a vector for disease.

There is scientific Method. You have a hypothesis that Typhoid Mary was a scapegoat rather than source of some outbreak of typhoid fever. Now you have stated that you have explored your hypothesis and you have a theory. Any theory is only 99% sort of thing. Nothing can be known 100% with science. We have scientific laws that even my great Scientist Dad, Doctor Grant O Gilbert, PhD taught me not to take at 100%. 100% Does not exist in science. A good scientist is willing to be wrong sometimes and still explore. I studied epidemiology just a bit at The Evergreen State College. There is something called a holding capacity of an environment for a species. The real unanswerable question is " What is the Holding Capacity of the planet earth for the human species?" This would help us determine courses of action if we are to rely on science for a solution to mankind problems.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by mister_coffee »

I don't know about any of that. Maybe if you posted your sources you used to draw those conclusions and showed your work?

Anyway, FWIW cases seem to be going down slightly in Okanogan County, but hospitalizations are still on the rise.

Elsewhere in the state it appears cases and hospitalizations are dropping.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by woodman »

Typhoid Mary(TM) and the leprosy described in the bible:

If TM was in the early stages of an infection I believe she would have eventually shown symptoms, although there may be a latency period at which time you may not show symptoms like, for example, Hepatitis B. A person who is initially exposed to HEPB doesn't show symptoms, but during that latency period (of maybe a few days) the hepatitis can spread from the host because the host is unaware. It might be a few days before symptoms are apparent to the host and in that window of time another person can be infected. With proper hand washing Hep B can be avoided, but the hepatitis doesn't just infect the host without eventually showing symptoms of disease. This is one of the reasons why I think the idea of asymptomatic spread is bogus and the true story of Typhoid Mary is not understood by many people. (Think about how one person can be poisoned by arsenic, ricin, or anthrax, but the host gets poisoned, and the poison does not spread to another person through the host.

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sf3.html#%2 ... %20CARRIER

As far as leprosy of the bible is concerned I believe that the lepers were the ultimate untouchables, but it was all based on ignorance, and fear mongering. Jesus never warned anybody to avoid the lepers. It is not clear from the bible that it is a contagious disease, yet, the lepers had to announce when they were approaching others. This would be interesting to find out the truth. I believe that it s as I say. I have heard that there are around 400 people in the US who have been diagnosed with leprosy yet I have never heard anybody raise concerns about people with this disease. In leprosy, the blood clotting factor is not working or something like that. I don't think it means that a lepers blood contains a dangerous pathogen.

I have educated myself further on the subject of bacteria and germs, and it is clear to me that "Typhoid Mary" was not an asymptomatic carrier, so she was not a vector for disease from what I have read. The most plausible explanations for why people got sick after eating food from the kitchen that she worked was that some food that had not been properly refrigerated, or food that had been left out had become poison kind of like botulism, but instead of doing a proper investigation they blamed her. This was 1906... Just because typhus was found in her blood does not mean that she was a vector for transmission. It is not the bacteria or germ itself that causes illness or disease, and IMO she was not contagious, or toxic, but since the setting was a kitchen, the most likely vector of illness for the diners was from the ingestion of rotting food (or meat may be most likely). Food that is left out long enough at low enough temperatures, or prepared food that is not chilled in a timely manner will develop poisonous by-products. She may have been culpable for not handling the food properly, but that is not the narrative we have been led to believe.

Last edited by woodman on Mon Feb 07, 2022 5:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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I didn't mean to distract from the original post. My post was way off topic. I meant to post it on the other thread. I let the moderator know. I don't know what else to do.

I don't know about giardia. I know that the movement of water can have a cleansing effect. A simple portable filter might be a good thing to bring with you.

I hope you are well my friend. I didn't realize this was off topic. Mostly when its facts and figures cutting and pasting its just nonsense to me. I wonder what people really have to talk about from their own minds. Statistics and science are scary when there is little understanding of the information. Sometimes common sense and that inner voice is all more correct than numbers and science that is beyond human comprehension.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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tristanbgilb wrote: Sat Feb 05, 2022 5:36 pm

When someone from the US goes to Mexico it is quite common to get a stomach ache, and some people vi/siting there from the US for the first time get very sick, but this seems kind of opposite to The typhoid Mary phenomenon. In this case there are microbes/parasites that you are exposed to. The local population has some level of immunity or daily routine that involves a parasite cleanser, but you can't blame the mexicans because it happens to a lot of visitors from the US, and enough people understand the science behind it.

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This is good water of the Twisp River not sterile, but I would drink it rather than go dehydrated. A lifetime of suffering begins with baby formula and on to coco puffs and mac and cheese. Really mostly calories lacking nutrition. It's a medical miracle modern people live as long as they do. Abuse after abuse and yet the human species continues on... Proof God watches over us all.

I didn't mean to distract from the original post. My post was way off topic. I meant to post it on the other thread. I let the moderator know. I don't know what else to do.

I don't know about giardia. I know that the movement of water can have a cleansing effect. A simple portable filter might be a good thing to bring with you.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by tristanbgilb »

When someone from the US goes to Mexico it is quite common to get a stomach ache, and some people vi/siting there from the US for the first time get very sick, but this seems kind of opposite to The typhoid Mary phenomenon. In this case there are microbes/parasites that you are exposed to. The local population has some level of immunity or daily routine that involves a parasite cleanser, but you can't blame the mexicans because it happens to a lot of visitors from the US, and enough people understand the science behind it.

Image
This is good water of the Twisp River not sterile, but I would drink it rather than go dehydrated. A lifetime of suffering begins with baby formula and on to coco puffs and mac and cheese. Really mostly calories lacking nutrition. It's a medical miracle modern people live as long as they do. Abuse after abuse and yet the human species continues on... Proof God watches over us all.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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woodman wrote: Sat Feb 05, 2022 4:19 pm

Typhoid Mary and the leprosy described in the bible:

http://www.whale.to/vaccine/sf3.html#%2 ... %20CARRIER

As far as leprosy of the bible is concerned I believe that the lepers were the ultimate untouchables, but it was all based on ignorance, and fear mongering. Jesus never warned anybody to avoid the lepers. It is not clear from the bible that it is a contagious disease, yet, the lepers had to announce when they were approaching others. This would be interesting to find out the truth. I believe that it's as I say. I have heard that there are around 400 people in the US who have been diagnosed with leprosy yet I have never heard anybody raise concerns about contagion for people with this disease. It is apparently caused by the bodies inability to clot the blood. The blood clotting factor is not working or something like that. I don't think it means that a lepers have a pathogen in their blood.

Last edited by woodman on Mon Feb 07, 2022 5:42 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

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Typhoid Mary and the leprosy described in the bible:

The thing is, way back in Mary’s day around 1906, hand washing wasn’t of great importance. In fact, surgeons used to wonder why their patients ended up dead after surgical intervention, until somebody discovered that they should wash their hands before performing surgery. Cooking, and food prep are pretty intimate processes. Personally, I don't think that "Typhoid Mary" was a carrier as we are led to believe by the accepted narrative. She appears to have been the vector for transmission, but after careful consideration I don't think that is the truth. She was a cook so I imagine she probably nibbled on healthy food so she very likely had a healthier diet than the people she worked for. This is conjecture, but I believe she was healthy.. I don't believe there was any malicious intent on her part, and I actually believe that possibly the authorities scapegoated her, well I know that they scapegoated her. If she was never sick I don't see how she could be an asymptomatic carrier. IMO if the authorities really understood the other more likely causal links they would have had no reason to quarantine her for 25 years. I believe there was a form of discrimination involved. If she was in the early stages of an infection I believe you eventually show symptoms although there may be a latency period at which time you may not show symptoms like, for example, Hepatitis B. A person who is initially exposed to HEPB doesn't show symptoms, but during that latency period the hepatitis can spread from the host because the host is unaware. It might be 5 days before symptoms are readily apparent to the host and in that window of time another person can be infected. With proper hand washing Hep B can be avoided, but the hepatitis doesn't just infect the host without eventually showing symptoms of disease. This is why I think the idea of asymptomatic spread is bogus and the true story of Typhoid Mary is not understood by many people. I believe the politics of the time may have played a role in how she was treated as well.

As far as leprosy of the bible is concerned I believe that the lepers were the ultimate untouchables, but it was all based on ignorance, and fear mongering. Jesus never warned anybody to avoid the lepers. It is not clear from the bible that it is a contagious disease, yet, the lepers had to announce when they were approaching others. This would be interesting to find out the truth. I believe that it s as I say. I have heard that there are around 400 people in the US who have been diagnosed with leprosy yet I have never heard anybody raise concerns about people with this disease. It is apparently caused by the bodies inability to clot the blood. The blood clotting factor is not working or something like that. I don't think it means that a lepers blood is pathogenic.

Last edited by woodman on Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by Rideback »

https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/omi ... 55d83d0e3e

Covid cases declining in all states but Alabama where they're up 7%.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by mister_coffee »

Honestly if the other BB recruited community members as moderators it wouldn't be that much work for them. But that would involve them writing specific and clear guidelines for what is acceptable and what is not.

Even on a public forum, not all threads are open for all comments. It would seem reasonable to me to have a higher standard for covid posts during this insane time period. It actually isn't that hard to filter out misinformation, especially since most of it wouldn't pass muster to someone who was actually awake in 7th grade science classes.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by Fun CH »

mister_coffee wrote: Thu Feb 03, 2022 8:57 am
pasayten wrote: Thu Jan 27, 2022 6:16 pm

Gee... Another Covid info thread was deleted on the methownet BB... Imagine that... :-)
...

Honestly, it isn't like anyone over there is really listening, but I do have to wonder about the ethical implications of what they are doing.

It also seems to me that there would be a technological or organizational solution to allowing certain covid posts. It seems reasonable they would all be moderated and there would be a clear Code of Conduct on what could be posted and what could not be (unfortunately, nobody actually reads those things).

An example of a decent Code of Conduct (that I just looked at this morning):

https://www.watchduty.org/code-of-conduct

at one point they had a pinned thread that had links to sites that held important public health and safety information. That's no longer there.

But anyone can access that Covid data from the county site.

Isn't the assumption that when you post on a public forum, the issue is open for discussion?

The owners at MN have stated that they don't want the discussion. Shouldn't their wish be respected by the community?

Ray has provided a local platform for discussion that is moderated, why not join here and post?

I'd like to see Jim B and Katie post here instead of inserting their political opinions that is just vaguely related to the thread topic at MNBB.

Comes off as excepted elitism, while others are banned for doing the same thing.

I still don't see how Mr. Coffee avoided the 'great MN purge'. You have moderated your language quite a bit here but for a while it was getting quite nasty here and over there.

And why hasn't Bruce H. been banned for trolling?

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by PAL »

The list I gave is only an excerpt too. I didn't include all the stats from the county's website.
The other BB would definitely have to monitor those Covid posts alot. Someone will post with good intentions, facts and stats and invariably someone will post a near snarky comment. And that does it.
I do appreciate this board. We don't get all that snarky. We can make up our minds about posts and know what the facts are and what are not.
I don't want misinformation to be posted, but it is. This way we know what others think. Know thine misinformation posts.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by mister_coffee »

pasayten wrote: Thu Jan 27, 2022 6:16 pm

Gee... Another Covid info thread was deleted on the methownet BB... Imagine that... :-)
...

Honestly, it isn't like anyone over there is really listening, but I do have to wonder about the ethical implications of what they are doing.

It also seems to me that there would be a technological or organizational solution to allowing certain covid posts. It seems reasonable they would all be moderated and there would be a clear Code of Conduct on what could be posted and what could not be (unfortunately, nobody actually reads those things).

An example of a decent Code of Conduct (that I just looked at this morning):

https://www.watchduty.org/code-of-conduct

:arrow: David Bonn :idea:
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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by Rideback »

Yes the younger groups are high, but with Omnicron circulating, even with this valley's high vax rate, it's not surprising. I am glad to see that there were no deaths in last week's stats.

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Re: Covid high in the Methow Valley...

Post by PAL »

Latest. Covid must be in the schools in some places to have these high of numbers. Okanogan County Health site shows the largest numbers in the age category 0-19.

COVID-19 Cases in Okanogan County by City
City Cases Reported January 26 - February 1, 2022
Brewster 90
Carlton 10
Conconully
Coulee Dam
Elmer City
Loomis 3
Malott 8
Mazama 3
Methow 4
Okanogan 55
Omak 140
Oroville 79
Pateros 19
Riverside 8
Tonasket 69
Twisp 50
Wauconda 1
Winthrop 21
Unidentified 3

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